Somebody should inform BK and Jamie McCourt that for the 90 million dollars it might cost for the Dodgers to sign Manny Ramirez for three years, you could instead buy 9,009,009 copies of the Jonas Brothers' "A Little Bit Longer" for the children of Southern Callifornia...
Every year Dodger fans complain that the Mccourts won't spend, and every year they flash the cash anyway. Is this year really going to be any different?
Most of those moves look pretty good (Ray Durham). I don't think Lowe can be re-signed. Go for Randy Johnson for some marque value (300 wins) and some good starts. Sign a bat like Dunn. Trade for Beltre. Since it looks like the Dodgers are going cheap (which might actually be a good idea) will they build those baseball fields?
What do the Jonas Brothers and pro ball players have in common? One day, birth certificates will surface exposing one of them as being several years older than we thought they were.
It is being reported today that the two teams most likely to sign Casey Blake are the Twins and our LA Dodgers. Considering the options on the market, I would be in favor of bringing Casey and his Barba Grande back season. DeWitt's production on offense is much more suitable for a second baseman than a third baseman, and that would leave SS as the only infield vacancy with a few internal canidates to choose from (Hu, DeJesus, Berrora, and !gasp! Toni Abreau) to man the SS helm.
The main sticking point on Blake's signing with either the Twins or Dodgers is that he wants a three year contract. Are you all in favor of bringing Casey back given the other free agent options out there? (Beltre is NOT a free agent, so please don't even go there) Are you all in favor of offering Casey and his Beard a three year deal?
DBB--for cheap, yes. Do you know what he is asking for? The main issue is that his production is already in decline, and of course that will continue unabated. And if you look at his overall production, there's this weird, odd-year, even-year pattern in his numbers, which implies next year and 2011 would be down years for him. Strange stuff, yes, but when you're talking about a guy in his late years, well, it's something to consider.
Blueballs I agree with you, bringing back the beard is a good move unless they wanna pry zimmerman from the nationals. Other than him, i don't see any other viable 3B candidates out there. 3 years from Blake is a good call, he is durable, consistent and an all around good guy who plays hard. That is veteran leadership we need unlike Mr salty Kent.
Signing Blake means that I'd be able to make ZZ Top references for a few more years, and that's always a good thing. I'm not convinced of his value over DeWitt, though.
"Yesterday, Yahoo's Tim Brown said Jim McDowell's (Casey Blake's agent) initial request was $20MM over three years for Blake."
I would think the Dodgers have a slight edge over the Twins, in that if Minnesota does sign Blake, L.A. gets a sandwich pick in the draft because of it - or does it even matter? It's not as if the Twins lose THEIR pick to L.A., right? Just a thought.
I'd be OK bringing him back with a 2 year deal, he's a solid guy at third. But at his age, to offer him three years? The only reason to do that is to realize that he's going to start this year and then may be a good utility guy, but that may not be what his plan is.
My main issue is this. Blake is solid, but you could move DeWitt to third and not lose much in stats as he gets more experience. But Blake is not a game changer, like Manny or Furcal, when healthy. I think 4 years is a gamble with Furcal too, but if I'm tossing around 3 years Blake vs. 4 years Furcal, I've gotta give Furcal the offer. Not only does he spark their lineup (when he's in it), but he also fills the leadoff spot. Even if you bring Blake and Berroa back, who's leading off? Neither Martin nor Kemp are legit leadoff guys.
Bringing back Blake would be a huge mistake. He's at best an average defensive third baseman, and a .260-.270 hitter, with OK power, but nothing to get excited about. And VA makes a good point about him being on the downside of his career. Without considering other options at 3B (trades, etc.) I believe that DeWitt is the better choice at third. He's far superior defensively (I read the other day that he led NL third basemen in range factor in 2008), and given that he's on the upside of his career, he might well match, if not exceed, Blake's power.
DeWitt also may not be suited to 2B. And despite DBB's "gasp" regarding Tony Abreu, let's not forget that he did a nice job with the bat in 2007, and displayed both range and a very strong arm at 2B. Until he got hurt in 2007 Abreu did NOT have a history of injury. And as I pointed out in an earlier post, there is good reason to believe that the hip labrum tear that was discovered last year was present from the beginning, and like Jayson Werth, he was the victim of a mis-diagnosis in 2007. Current reports indicate that he is healthy, and ready to begin playing winter ball in the Dominican Republic. I still consider him to be a question mark, but I wouldn't be too fast to dismiss him.
BK
You know, I really cannot fathom why so many Dodger bloggers and I thought true fans, that are so quick to give up on Manny, and not want to resign him like they are the ones who will pay him even though they may pay a little more for a beer or dog. (You won't pay Manny off hotdogs and beer) I am appalled. Many think it is too much money or too many years or the economy is bad or we need new youth parks or we have other holes to fill or Manny is too old or Manny will be Manny, or lets bring up some more kids.. Anything except that Manny is the reason the Dodgers won the west last year, and will be a determining factor on whether or not the Dodgers win the west next year. The whole time the McCourts were making money off Manny. Many were praising Manny last year when he was spanking homeruns and driving in many, many runs and having a positive influence in the clubhouse. None were saying, "Gee we don't need Manny" Now some think the Dodgers can just survive with the kids and whatever "run of the mill" free agent they can sign. Some say the Dodgers should get pitching and they should but Manny should not be excluded from the mix. I too did not think the Dodgers could win even when they obtained Manny but he brought back confidence and pride in the Dodgers. Now I am a believer and I think some should reevaluate their positions on whether or not Manny should be brought back. Now that I have said it, I feel much better.
$7 million per year for Casey Blake is money that could be better spent on Orlando Hudson, who is much younger and would be an offensive sparkplug. Blake is solid defensively, but average offensively.
Besides, keeping two Blakes on the team will only confuse Broxton on come-backers. Throw to Blake!
Here's a lineup I'd like to see for 2009
Hudson 2B
Ethier RF
Kemp CF
Dunn LF
Loney 1B
Martin C
Renteria SS
DeWitt 3B
Two big problems with this lineup: No true leadoff hitter and no true #3 hitter. I put Kemp in the 3-hole just to break up the lefties. That's another reason Troy Glaus is so appealing: he solves two problems for the Dodgers: a third baseman and a power-hitting righty.
Thanks for your feedback everyone. You all bring some good pro & con arguements to the table about resigning Blake or using DeWitt at third!
BD-
I would be stoked if Toni came back healthy next season at second base. His bat was impressive in 2007, so let's hope he does well at Winter Ball and Spring Training.
Package-
I agree that bringing Manny back next season is essential! The offense without him and Furcal next season would be so pediestrian. Thank you for grabbing your soapbox and echoing my sentiments!
The reason why, if I were running the show, that I would sign CC over Manny is the following:
If our rotation can't cut it in the playoffs, is it worth making it there in the first place? It's a bit jaded, sure, but I don't think what we currently have as 1-2-3 can be competitive in a playoff setting, where it matters most. Billingsly is going to be an ace, sure, but many playoff teams (Cubs, D'Backs, etc) have aces that are at least on par with him if not better. After that comes Kuroda, who should be better next year but still strikes me as a number 3. Following that, we'll have somebody who's young (Kershaw, McDonald, Stults). It's a rotation that will probably do okay in the regular season but when it gets down to 8 it won't cut it. CC would make our rotation better than anybody's, and I'm in the pitching wins championships camp (and I stated that throughout the whole Manny period).
Manny is definitely the more "fun" acquisition, though, and will put butts in the seats. But so will winning playoff games. However, I won't be disappointed if we land Manny, as long as the contract is reasonable and we get another competent starter (RJ one year actually makes a lot of sense).
Andrew (right) and Brian Kamenetzky are hosts of the LA Times Lakers Blog, and contributing writers to ESPN The Magazine and ESPN.com. Additionally, they co-authored Fishing on the Edge, the autobiography of Mike Iaconelli, the bad boy of bass fishing and 2003 Bassmaster Classic champion. They grew up in St. Louis as Cardinals fans, but it doesn't impair their ability to Think Blue. After all, the Cards and Dodgers aren't even in the same division.
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Can any of the Jonas Brothers hit clean-up?
Posted by: LLCoolL | December 02, 2008 at 01:26 PM
Somebody should inform BK and Jamie McCourt that for the 90 million dollars it might cost for the Dodgers to sign Manny Ramirez for three years, you could instead buy 9,009,009 copies of the Jonas Brothers' "A Little Bit Longer" for the children of Southern Callifornia...
Posted by: DodgerBlueBalls | December 02, 2008 at 01:33 PM
LLCoolL,
From what I hear, there's a lesser known fourth Jonas Brother from Curacao who's just gangbusters with the stick.
AK
Posted by: kambrothers | December 02, 2008 at 02:00 PM
Every year Dodger fans complain that the Mccourts won't spend, and every year they flash the cash anyway. Is this year really going to be any different?
Posted by: Asaldo | December 02, 2008 at 02:36 PM
Most of those moves look pretty good (Ray Durham). I don't think Lowe can be re-signed. Go for Randy Johnson for some marque value (300 wins) and some good starts. Sign a bat like Dunn. Trade for Beltre. Since it looks like the Dodgers are going cheap (which might actually be a good idea) will they build those baseball fields?
Posted by: A Scanner Darkly | December 02, 2008 at 02:41 PM
What do the Jonas Brothers and pro ball players have in common? One day, birth certificates will surface exposing one of them as being several years older than we thought they were.
Posted by: joshburke2 | December 02, 2008 at 03:48 PM
Josh Burke,
Very clever.
AK
Posted by: kambrothers | December 02, 2008 at 05:04 PM
I showed up late to the chat, read it later, a lot of good stuff.
I did try to look up the fall & winter leagues, but found that most of them were subscription only.
If I've failed at my due diligence, and there is some link that is free, Please let me know!!
Thanks!
Posted by: lizzieinsb | December 02, 2008 at 06:04 PM
AK/BK
What?? You guys won't be at the winter meetings? The times should be glad to send you guys. You are the most informative writers the Times have.
Package
Posted by: Package | December 02, 2008 at 06:58 PM
AK/BK
By the way, when did you guys decide to have a chat? I had a few questions for you. No Notice.
Package
Posted by: Package | December 02, 2008 at 07:00 PM
Package,
The decision was relatively last minute, so we could use some mutually free time. Sorry if the notice wasn't enough.
AK
Posted by: kambrothers | December 02, 2008 at 07:22 PM
Thanks, Package.
We put up a notice this morning, around 10, I think.
BK
Posted by: kambrothers | December 02, 2008 at 07:27 PM
Package,
I'd recommend you sign up for the Blue Notes Blog facebook page, my friend. You'll easily be kept up to date with all things Kamenetzky!
Posted by: DodgerBlueBalls | December 02, 2008 at 07:28 PM
Peeps,
It is being reported today that the two teams most likely to sign Casey Blake are the Twins and our LA Dodgers. Considering the options on the market, I would be in favor of bringing Casey and his Barba Grande back season. DeWitt's production on offense is much more suitable for a second baseman than a third baseman, and that would leave SS as the only infield vacancy with a few internal canidates to choose from (Hu, DeJesus, Berrora, and !gasp! Toni Abreau) to man the SS helm.
The main sticking point on Blake's signing with either the Twins or Dodgers is that he wants a three year contract. Are you all in favor of bringing Casey back given the other free agent options out there? (Beltre is NOT a free agent, so please don't even go there) Are you all in favor of offering Casey and his Beard a three year deal?
Posted by: DodgerBlueBalls | December 03, 2008 at 11:00 AM
DBB--for cheap, yes. Do you know what he is asking for? The main issue is that his production is already in decline, and of course that will continue unabated. And if you look at his overall production, there's this weird, odd-year, even-year pattern in his numbers, which implies next year and 2011 would be down years for him. Strange stuff, yes, but when you're talking about a guy in his late years, well, it's something to consider.
Posted by: VA Blueblood | December 03, 2008 at 11:33 AM
Blueballs I agree with you, bringing back the beard is a good move unless they wanna pry zimmerman from the nationals. Other than him, i don't see any other viable 3B candidates out there. 3 years from Blake is a good call, he is durable, consistent and an all around good guy who plays hard. That is veteran leadership we need unlike Mr salty Kent.
Posted by: poppinfresh | December 03, 2008 at 11:52 AM
Signing Blake means that I'd be able to make ZZ Top references for a few more years, and that's always a good thing. I'm not convinced of his value over DeWitt, though.
Posted by: DBrim | December 03, 2008 at 01:52 PM
"Yesterday, Yahoo's Tim Brown said Jim McDowell's (Casey Blake's agent) initial request was $20MM over three years for Blake."
I would think the Dodgers have a slight edge over the Twins, in that if Minnesota does sign Blake, L.A. gets a sandwich pick in the draft because of it - or does it even matter? It's not as if the Twins lose THEIR pick to L.A., right? Just a thought.
Posted by: Gibby's Limp | December 03, 2008 at 02:32 PM
I'd be OK bringing him back with a 2 year deal, he's a solid guy at third. But at his age, to offer him three years? The only reason to do that is to realize that he's going to start this year and then may be a good utility guy, but that may not be what his plan is.
My main issue is this. Blake is solid, but you could move DeWitt to third and not lose much in stats as he gets more experience. But Blake is not a game changer, like Manny or Furcal, when healthy. I think 4 years is a gamble with Furcal too, but if I'm tossing around 3 years Blake vs. 4 years Furcal, I've gotta give Furcal the offer. Not only does he spark their lineup (when he's in it), but he also fills the leadoff spot. Even if you bring Blake and Berroa back, who's leading off? Neither Martin nor Kemp are legit leadoff guys.
Posted by: neoncactus | December 03, 2008 at 03:01 PM
Bringing back Blake would be a huge mistake. He's at best an average defensive third baseman, and a .260-.270 hitter, with OK power, but nothing to get excited about. And VA makes a good point about him being on the downside of his career. Without considering other options at 3B (trades, etc.) I believe that DeWitt is the better choice at third. He's far superior defensively (I read the other day that he led NL third basemen in range factor in 2008), and given that he's on the upside of his career, he might well match, if not exceed, Blake's power.
DeWitt also may not be suited to 2B. And despite DBB's "gasp" regarding Tony Abreu, let's not forget that he did a nice job with the bat in 2007, and displayed both range and a very strong arm at 2B. Until he got hurt in 2007 Abreu did NOT have a history of injury. And as I pointed out in an earlier post, there is good reason to believe that the hip labrum tear that was discovered last year was present from the beginning, and like Jayson Werth, he was the victim of a mis-diagnosis in 2007. Current reports indicate that he is healthy, and ready to begin playing winter ball in the Dominican Republic. I still consider him to be a question mark, but I wouldn't be too fast to dismiss him.
Posted by: Brooklyn Dodger | December 03, 2008 at 03:54 PM
BK
You know, I really cannot fathom why so many Dodger bloggers and I thought true fans, that are so quick to give up on Manny, and not want to resign him like they are the ones who will pay him even though they may pay a little more for a beer or dog. (You won't pay Manny off hotdogs and beer) I am appalled. Many think it is too much money or too many years or the economy is bad or we need new youth parks or we have other holes to fill or Manny is too old or Manny will be Manny, or lets bring up some more kids.. Anything except that Manny is the reason the Dodgers won the west last year, and will be a determining factor on whether or not the Dodgers win the west next year. The whole time the McCourts were making money off Manny. Many were praising Manny last year when he was spanking homeruns and driving in many, many runs and having a positive influence in the clubhouse. None were saying, "Gee we don't need Manny" Now some think the Dodgers can just survive with the kids and whatever "run of the mill" free agent they can sign. Some say the Dodgers should get pitching and they should but Manny should not be excluded from the mix. I too did not think the Dodgers could win even when they obtained Manny but he brought back confidence and pride in the Dodgers. Now I am a believer and I think some should reevaluate their positions on whether or not Manny should be brought back. Now that I have said it, I feel much better.
Package
Posted by: Package | December 03, 2008 at 04:27 PM
$7 million per year for Casey Blake is money that could be better spent on Orlando Hudson, who is much younger and would be an offensive sparkplug. Blake is solid defensively, but average offensively.
Besides, keeping two Blakes on the team will only confuse Broxton on come-backers. Throw to Blake!
Here's a lineup I'd like to see for 2009
Hudson 2B
Ethier RF
Kemp CF
Dunn LF
Loney 1B
Martin C
Renteria SS
DeWitt 3B
Two big problems with this lineup: No true leadoff hitter and no true #3 hitter. I put Kemp in the 3-hole just to break up the lefties. That's another reason Troy Glaus is so appealing: he solves two problems for the Dodgers: a third baseman and a power-hitting righty.
Posted by: SaMo | December 03, 2008 at 06:40 PM
Thanks for your feedback everyone. You all bring some good pro & con arguements to the table about resigning Blake or using DeWitt at third!
BD-
I would be stoked if Toni came back healthy next season at second base. His bat was impressive in 2007, so let's hope he does well at Winter Ball and Spring Training.
Package-
I agree that bringing Manny back next season is essential! The offense without him and Furcal next season would be so pediestrian. Thank you for grabbing your soapbox and echoing my sentiments!
Posted by: DodgerBlueBalls | December 03, 2008 at 06:50 PM
"None were saying, "Gee we don't need Manny""
You callin' me a nobody, Package?
;>)
Posted by: VA Blueblood | December 03, 2008 at 06:57 PM
Package:
The reason why, if I were running the show, that I would sign CC over Manny is the following:
If our rotation can't cut it in the playoffs, is it worth making it there in the first place? It's a bit jaded, sure, but I don't think what we currently have as 1-2-3 can be competitive in a playoff setting, where it matters most. Billingsly is going to be an ace, sure, but many playoff teams (Cubs, D'Backs, etc) have aces that are at least on par with him if not better. After that comes Kuroda, who should be better next year but still strikes me as a number 3. Following that, we'll have somebody who's young (Kershaw, McDonald, Stults). It's a rotation that will probably do okay in the regular season but when it gets down to 8 it won't cut it. CC would make our rotation better than anybody's, and I'm in the pitching wins championships camp (and I stated that throughout the whole Manny period).
Manny is definitely the more "fun" acquisition, though, and will put butts in the seats. But so will winning playoff games. However, I won't be disappointed if we land Manny, as long as the contract is reasonable and we get another competent starter (RJ one year actually makes a lot of sense).
Posted by: DBrim | December 03, 2008 at 06:59 PM